Instant karma's gonna get you

Crew chief Jerry Crawford will explain the umpire’s rationale behind ruling that Jorge Posada fly ball a two-run homer after today’s game.

My early guess is that the umpires will say Trevor Crowe’s glove cleared the plane of the outfield wall. If that’s the case, it doesn’t matter if a fan touches his glove, per this portion of Rule 3.16:

“No interference shall be allowed when a fielder reaches over a fence, railing, rope or into a stand to catch a ball. He does so at his own risk.”

Again, that’s just my guess. We’ll see what that umps have to say afterward. 

For what it’s worth, I think the play that really needs to be reviewed is Eric Wedge’s decision to yank Pavano after six strong innings and 89 pitches to bring in the struggling Perez.

UPDATE: The umpires offered no comment on the play. Wedge said he was told by Crawford that the ball hit the fan first, beyond the fence. The replays are sketchy and do little to clear this up, either way.

21 Comments

I still think it’s a bunch of bologna! And what was with Choo out in left in the bottom of the 8th??? He like slowed down because he thought it was going foul! Um, no! Yeah, it’s great we at least split the series, but the way we lost was unacceptable. *sigh*

About Pavano. Completely right, but pitch count might have forced the change. More importantly, why Jensen who gave up a similar homer friday and is a fly ball pitcher. Add the call of pitching the lefthanded Posada inside and I was calling the homer as soon as Shoppach set up. But it wasnt a homer. Clearly there was contact inside the field of play. Otherwise the ball wouldnt have come back down on crowe after the contact (or did it never clear at all). Also, it seems that both yankee stadiums have a history with such calls (add in the Delgado homer last year that necessitated the change to replay) and share a similar feature that may have something to do with that. Neither stadium has a yellow-line boundary. Not only is there no yellow line across any part of the wall, but the ad placed on the portion in question is itself solid yellow, a color that pops out and impedes the ability of umpire to distinguish a homer from interference. With nearly every other stadium including a yellow-line boundary, what gives the Yankees the right to be different? For 1.5 billion dollars, I have no doubt they can afford the paint!

Yeah, the home run call was questionable, but that’s not why we lost. Eric Wedge lost this game. Even if Pavano was tiring a bit (he struggled some in the 6th), he still had a better chance than Perez. I’m sure Perez will get it together eventually, but until he does, he shouldn’t be out there in that situation. And if Wedge can’t see that, he has no business being a major league manager. This isn’t the first time his mismanagement of the pitching staff has cost the Indians a game.

I was watching the game on TBS and both of the announcers felt that the umps got it wrong and that there was fan interference.

Julia
http://werbiefitz.mlblogs.com/

A relief pitcher with a sub-2 ERA was used with a 20-4 lead yesterday. (And he pitched two hitless innings, by the way.)

A relief pitcher with a 14+ ERA, who has given up 11 earned runs, on 8 hits, 9 walks, and 1 HBPs in 7 innings, was brought in with a 3-1 lead today.

Way to go, Wedgie.

Yeah, I agree that Wedge screwed up big time today. I am not your typical Eric Wedge hater either, as I often give him the benefit of the doubt, and don’t forget the success we had in ’07, or that it wasn’t his fault that we lost to Boston.

With that said, unless Pavano said he was done, I have no idea why he came out. Yes he gave up a couple hits in the 6th, but he really hadn’t been hit too hard all day, and I believe he would have faced the bottom of the order in the 7th.

But going to Perez was probably the biggest mistake. What was Wedge thinking? I think Wedge gets too caught up with names and past stats (like how he refused to move Pronk out of the 4 spot) and rather then have Perez work his trouble out when we are down in a game, gave him the ball over other guys who have been doing better. I know everyone thought Masa would be terrible, but so far, so good with him, and I think he has earned the right to pitch in moments like today’s for the time-being, rather then in a 22-4 blow out. I have brought this up before, but this reminds me of Craig Breslow, who has better numbers then everyone in our bullpen at the end of last year, and I am pretty sure had the best or second best numbers when we cut him loose, but Wedge and maybe Shapiro to, get too caught up in what they think someone is capable of, or what they did a year or two ago, rather the go with the hot hand. I usually don’t blame a manager too much, but managing the bullpen and pitching staff is perhaps the biggest area they can influence a club, and I am really starting to be persuaded that Wedge is not very good at that.

Ahh. Whatever. Thanks for letting me vent.

Normally I am a Wedge supporter, but today’s positioning of Choo in left and a struggling Perez pitching in the 8th are wrong. Both woulda been cool yesterday, but Yeesh, you are about to win a series in NY- opening of a new ballpark and all. Go with what has been working- not Choo (not ever going to win a gold glove, but a great hitter) or Perez. What about Smith? Righty/lefty be damned, he’s looked pretty good so far.

Using stats to back up an argument is a good habit, but using stats this early in the season as though they can predict future performance puts your point on shaky ground. Would you have skipped Cliff Lee for the tough start against the yankees because his ERA was near 10 after his first two games?

I think Wedge puts a lot of weight in the importance of confidence. That’s why he had Hafner batting fourth when we all would’ve put him lower in the order. That has worked out ok so far. Maybe he thinks that using Perez as mop-up would show that he’d lost faith in the lefty.

Either way, I’m certain that, regardless of the situation, Masa and Perez’s ERAs will both move closer to 4.00 by this time next month.

Hello A.C. That ball that Crowe tryed to catch was not a home run. the umps missed up on that call plan and simple. But then after that the bullpen emplouded both Raffys gave up runs and the offense left a hole bunch of base runners on. Man oh man a 4-9 star but again I am not worried about the indians yet.

betancourt shouldnt have given up a run. he pitched well today (other than losing matsui after 0-2) and has been pretty consistent all year. Move to go to perez and lewis was awful though.

That reminds me. Friday, Joe Smith 1/3 of an inning. Vinnie Chulk up one in the 7th? Jensen Lewis tied in the 8th? This is a pattern. It isnt that our bullpen is bad, it is just that our hot hands are been forced to sit on their hands on the bullpen bench while some of our guys who have struggled in the onset are being put into pressure situations that they are clearly not ready to handle.

Carl Pavano was pretty outstanding today… But the Tribe’s bullpen has really got to pick it up. I wouldn’t say taking Pavano out was a bad idea, but Perez has been struggling lately. That may have been the bad idea. He’s really missing the strike zone…
And that fan with the glove was definitely reaching over the wall on Posada’s hit.

My comment will be towards the point of view of Mr. Wedge giving opportunities to guys like Jensen Lewis, and guys like Jeremy Sowers who has had his chances to prove where he belongs, and we all know its not in the big leagues, or at least with the indians..! Jensen has lot some significant speed on his pitches, he’s been struggling for a long time now.! Why not bringing Betancourt to face Posada? or somebody else on the bullpen like Kobayashi, who has a lot of movement on his pitches..! No matter what happened to Crowe in right field, he shouldnt have allowed that long fly ball, since we know that every fly ball to right field in yankee stadium has 50% of being a home run..! So what i saw was that Jensen gave Posada a pich to hit and not that Posada made Jensen threw something good for him to hit..! So he should reconsider giving Lewis a chance in games like this.. and more when the team is being going on a slow start and when every win counts..!

it’s very simple, use Joe Smith as the setup pitcher until Perez can figure his stuff out. Perez was awful last April, so I see a bit of a trend, add on to the fact that I think he pitched in the WBC and didn’t get his usual work in, that’s his problem. Pavano had 11 pitches left to get to 100, so I would have had him face Cano and Matsui, then put Smith in to face Ranson at least. As far as Jensen goes, there is no excuse. He was awful last April and they said his velocity was down last April, but I hadn’t seen that problem this year. I had also seen him pitch very well this year before, he can do it again. And why is nobody talking about Rafael Betancourt here? The guy is afraid to put hitters away when he’s ahead of the count. That was what he did in 2007 and now he nibbles. Someone needs to take him aside and give him a stern talk about putting hitters away. He walked 2 hitters and gave up 3 runs to a career utility infielder. Totally unacceptable.

Why doesn’t Cleveland quit being so afraid to spend a little extra money and sign a relief pitcher who can actually provide a little relief for the team?

I think ruling that play a home run is like assuming a double play – what are the rules at that park for ground-rule doubles? Honestly, if I were Crowe, I would’ve gone Ape**** on those umpires after the ruling. We took that a little too calmly.
I also think we kind of quit after that all happened, and that made me more upset. I was getting used to my Indians going up against the “big boys” and not backing down.
Oh well Tribe fans – take heart: the 2 Yankees wins aren’t without controversy (DeRosa’s strikeout on Friday; J. Mayer Part Deux on Sunday) and we have handed them some of their worst losses in franchise history.
I do buy into the ‘jet stream’ theory – I’ve been to too many games in life to not believe that. I’m not totally down on our bullpen, but I wonder if we should switch up the order that the guys come in at? Maybe bring in Jensen before we bring in Perez, at least for now?

Thank you, “cantonguy.” We should have swept the Yankees. There is no middle relief & it is a shame that “no one” saw that Raphael Betancourt was losing it last year. What has happened to Raphael Perez? SD, the owner (“S” standing for stingy), is wasting a year by not spending a little bit for decent middle relief. Obviously, we have the bats, but if we are going to lose five out of every eight games because of middle relief, our .300 something percentage will be just that in September. Don’t blame Wedge and don’t blame Shapiro! Blame Dolan! The answer will be, “…but it is too late to get new guys for relief.” Exactly! It is too late! Some one should have thought of that in November.

Another thing: It’s going to be interesting to see how many are in the stands this week against KC.

I’m so mad I could spit venom. This was not Eric Wedge’s fault, it was the umps, who have now cost the Indians 4 wins (2 in KC and 2 in NY) here in the early going. I’d like to see more frustration out of Cleveland, also. Complacency says we’ll settle for being f-ed over every time we take the field. I wish Robbie Alomar was still on the team.

Jason
http://jmays.mlblogs.com

I am not going to comment on the debacle that was the Yankee series since there have been countless hindsight 20-20 analyses of such. The basic rule of thumb is that a typical manager will win and lose you 10 games each year and what your players do with the remaining 142 games matters more. Wedge lost two this series IMO. HOWEVER, someone needs to approach Wedge and give him this simple cliche to think about : you cannot win your division in April. You can lose it though. Sooner or later this man needs to be held accountable for his actions, players, and results therein.

Add me to the growing list that questions the pitching decisions in yesterday’s game. The call was the worst case of home field advantage I’ve seen in a long time. You absolutely knew the umps wouldn’t overturn something that the Yankee fans would get mad about.

And while I understand the desire to use Perez (he’s their lefty set up man and we need to give him chances to work his stuff out now while we can still afford to), a game like this required the use of Joe Smith. I think most people wondered why Lewis was being thrown out there.

And I’m pretty sure Pavano’s pitch count must have been the reason they pulled him, although he did struggle in the bottom of the 6th.

At least we got some quality starts out of our rotation this time around.

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